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Model 12 Trigger Group ID

This is a discussion on Model 12 Trigger Group ID within the Winchester Shotgun Forum forums, part of the Shotgun Forums by Model category; I am hoping that someone can help me identify this pair of Trigger Groups. My father passed away a while ago and I have been ...



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Old 01-07-2019, 06:13 PM   #1
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Model 12 Trigger Group ID

I am hoping that someone can help me identify this pair of Trigger Groups. My father passed away a while ago and I have been slowly clearing out his gun parts from my mom's house. After searching many hundreds of pictures, I am pretty sure these are from a Winchester Model 12. To the best of my knowledge he never owned one though. I can't find any marking on them to help determine the grade of gun or gauge but for now I am assuming they are 12 gauge. The two shell carriers are are nearly identical with the exception of the shape of the front nose and the underside machining of one looks more refined than the other. Is there any way to ID & date these? I want to make 100% sure that I don't misrepresent them when I try to sell them. Any ballpark guess as to approximate value that you could share? I am really out of my league with all this stuff.

Thanks for the help !
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Model 12 Trigger Group ID-img_0313.jpg   Model 12 Trigger Group ID-img_0314.jpg   Model 12 Trigger Group ID-img_0318.jpg   Model 12 Trigger Group ID-img_0328.jpg   Model 12 Trigger Group ID-img_0325.jpg  

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Old 01-09-2019, 03:00 PM   #2
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they look both 20ga. the jeweling indicates high grades....skeet most likely.
look closely on the carrier and trigger frame. they should be marked 12-16-20. look.
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Old 01-10-2019, 06:18 AM   #3
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bobski - thanks for the reply. I have seen pictures of others and have seen the marking you have described, but mine do not carry any markings that I can see. I have thoroughly cleaned and moved every part that can move, but no luck uncovering any numbers. I really don't want to start taking them apart and not sure it would help at this point. Are there other dimensional features that can be used to determine what gauge these are?

Could the non-marking be associated with some date of manufacture?
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:30 AM   #4
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im not a smith. so measuring is out.
but knowing your father may help. did he shoot a lot of clay birds?
if you want to send them to me, I can try to fit them into my m12's. I have all the gauge guns.
just a thought. I don't mind.
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:31 AM   #5
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do you have some shells? slide the rims of few different ones down the top of the carrier and see which one matches the curve.
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Old 01-10-2019, 07:33 PM   #6
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bobski - good idea. The 12 gauge rim fits nearly perfectly in the front radius portion of the carrier on both of them. A 20 ga is very sloppy. So, based on that, I guess I can conclude these are 12 ga.

My dad was more likely to shoot trap but it was always O/U as far back as I can remember. He never had a Model 12 to my knowledge so I am a bit stumped at why he had these carefully wrapped up and preserved.

What grades with jeweled carriers can I list that these could have come on? Do you think here is a good place to list parts?
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:51 PM   #7
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All post-'64 Model 12's had jeweled bolts. This included the Field, Skeet, Trap, and Super Pigeon grades, the only models then being made. I do not recall if the jeweling included the shell carriers. Most of the Model 12s we had at the USAF ranges during the '50s and '60s were pre-'64 models, except for some post-'64 new ones that came in for trap shooting. If I were to make a guess, I would believe that the jeweling on these trigger groups were custom jeweled. The jewel circles are smaller and more precise than those I remember being on the bolts of the trap guns.
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Old 01-10-2019, 09:17 PM   #8
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The one on the right in the close up picture is extremely uniform whereas the one on the left appears to be less so, but careful inspection shows a bit of wear from dragging the shells during loading which seems to disrupt the uniformity. Like I stated earlier, I think I am way over my head here and don't know diddly about Model 12s. I was just hoping I could figure out exactly what they were and turn them into some $$ for my mom. I am making some headway, but after today it seems I have more questions than when I started. I hate advertising something that I can't fully describe because I am always afraid that it will somehow get misrepresented, so it looks like these are going back in the box until I have time to learn a lot more. Anyway - I really do appreciate the help and comments.
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Old 10-03-2019, 08:50 PM   #9
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Both of those appear to be from 12 gauge guns. My smaller gauge model 12s have a vertical side shield alongside of the shell carrier. Yours does not.
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Old 10-04-2019, 06:07 AM   #10
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my 28's have side shields. my 20's dont.
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